Author Topic: Wikipedia Updates  (Read 11910 times)

rachek

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Re: Wikipedia Updates
« Reply #15 on: January 01, 2012, 04:22:48 pm »

[/quote]
I am working on HMS Enterprise sounding off Sangat Island in February 1917.  My Wiki entry shows:

HMS Enterprise (D52) was one of two Emerald-class light cruisers of the Royal Navy. She was built by John Brown Shipbuilding & Engineering Company Ltd., with the keel being laid down on 28 June 1918. - so the dates don't match.

I am enjoying this project - thank you
[/quote]
You seem to have highlighted a mystery ship. Clearly, as we have the logs, there was an HMS Enterprise operating before the Emerald Class cruiser and not included in the list at:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_Enterprise
but I've not been able to find any further information.
She seems to have been involved in surveying duties - from the pages I've visited, in (a) river(s).
[/quote]

I have found two other references which may apply:

http://collections.rmg.co.uk/collections/objects/540830.html
Single sheet. Col. Scale: 1:50 000. Contents Note: Chart in five compartments (A to E). Sailing directions, Inset: Lake Timsah surveyed by Lieut. Commr. A.F.B. Woodhouse, R.N. and officers of H.M. surveying ship 'Enterprise' 1918.

http://www.naval-history.net/xDKCas1918-03Mar.htm
Monday, 18 March 1918  Enterprise (2), hired net drifter

 TAYLOR, Andrew, Ty/Skipper, RNR,  died in accident in UK

there are so many Enterprises and sometimes they were renamed.

Thanks for replying.  I am a mathematician, not a naval historian and will not be editing the Wiki entry.

Bunting Tosser

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Re: Wikipedia Updates
« Reply #16 on: January 01, 2012, 06:44:31 pm »

I am working on HMS Enterprise sounding off Sangat Island in February 1917.  My Wiki entry shows:

HMS Enterprise (D52) was one of two Emerald-class light cruisers of the Royal Navy. She was built by John Brown Shipbuilding & Engineering Company Ltd., with the keel being laid down on 28 June 1918. - so the dates don't match.

I am enjoying this project - thank you
You seem to have highlighted a mystery ship. Clearly, as we have the logs, there was an HMS Enterprise operating before the Emerald Class cruiser and not included in the list at:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_Enterprise
but I've not been able to find any further information.
She seems to have been involved in surveying duties - from the pages I've visited, in (a) river(s).

Quote
I have found two other references which may apply:

http://collections.rmg.co.uk/collections/objects/540830.html
Single sheet. Col. Scale: 1:50 000. Contents Note: Chart in five compartments (A to E). Sailing directions, Inset: Lake Timsah surveyed by Lieut. Commr. A.F.B. Woodhouse, R.N. and officers of H.M. surveying ship 'Enterprise' 1918.

http://www.naval-history.net/xDKCas1918-03Mar.htm
Monday, 18 March 1918  Enterprise (2), hired net drifter

 TAYLOR, Andrew, Ty/Skipper, RNR,  died in accident in UK

there are so many Enterprises and sometimes they were renamed.

Thanks for replying.  I am a mathematician, not a naval historian and will not be editing the Wiki entry.


Hi rachek,
For reasons previously stated (surveying) I am sure the charts resulted from your HMS Enterprise.

The other reference:
http://www.naval-history.net/xDKCas1918-03Mar.htm
Monday, 18 March 1918  Enterprise (2), hired net drifter

is to one of the several uncommissioned Enterprises operating in and around home waters. I am forced to the unsatisfactory conclusion that I shan't see a resolution in this lifetime.
I wouldn't blame anyone for leaving this tangle untreated.
Good work in spotting yet another Wiki failure.  ;)

Bunts
« Last Edit: January 05, 2012, 05:00:25 pm by Bunting Tosser »

Kathy

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Re: Wikipedia Updates
« Reply #17 on: January 05, 2012, 05:12:05 pm »
Hi all -

I have posted messages left and right in Wiki - the Military Projects and Ship Projects, as well emailed Mr. Wales and have yet to receive any sort of response.  I did make changes to the article on HMS Aphis to include info about her stint in and around Port Said and those changes have not be removed, so I'm thinking I just start updating articles as we run across info -

ta -

Kathy

Bunting Tosser

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Re: Wikipedia Updates
« Reply #18 on: January 05, 2012, 05:15:02 pm »
Hi all -

I have posted messages left and right in Wiki - the Military Projects and Ship Projects, as well emailed Mr. Wales and have yet to receive any sort of response.  I did make changes to the article on HMS Aphis to include info about her stint in and around Port Said and those changes have not be removed, so I'm thinking I just start updating articles as we run across info -

ta -

Kathy
Direct Action.
Right on, Sister.  8)

Kathy

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Re: Wikipedia Updates
« Reply #19 on: January 06, 2012, 02:23:17 pm »
I have now included the Galatea in the article on the Battle of the Heligobight, 1917, at some point soon I'll just rewrite the whole article.

Tegwen

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Re: Wikipedia Updates
« Reply #20 on: January 06, 2012, 03:25:13 pm »
I have now included the Galatea in the article on the Battle of the Heligobight, 1917, at some point soon I'll just rewrite the whole article.

Well done Kathy. Thanks very much for this. It is good to see Galatea mentioned. I agree with you that the whole article could do with a little rewriting. For example it says that there were casualties on the Calypso then reports the posthumous VC for the chap from the Caledon. In fact she suffered a hit on a turret in which several men were lost.

Let me know if I can help.

All the best. K

Janet Jaguar

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Re: Wikipedia Updates
« Reply #21 on: January 21, 2012, 06:11:34 am »
I gave up searching and wrote to our Gordon Smith, who owns Naval-History.net.  No wonder we couldn't find it, there are far too many Enterprises for anyone to track them all down!

Quote
Dear Janet,

This one won't come quietly!

The 1919 ENTERPRISE was a cruiser.

Other ENTERPRISES in World War 1, include:

Net Drifter PD.368, renamed ENTERTAIN from 7/18, served 9/14 to 1919 another net drifter ENTERPRISE, renamed ENTERPRISE II, 5/15, mined 3/16 off Brindisi

Armed launch ENTERPRISE, used in East Indies (included Indian Ocean up Red Sea to Suez), survey vessel 1916-19

Tug ENTERPRISE, probably Portsmouth-based, renamed EMPRISE 12/18, sold 1947

Two more hired tugs, ENTERPRISE II, served 5/15 to 4/19 and ENTERPRISE 4/15 to 8/19

I would think the armed launch is the likely one. Although small - maybe around 100 tons, but can't find any more information, her survey work would have meant keeping good records, including, I assume met readings.

A bit more information from her logs might help confirm this.
...
Gordon

My answer:
Quote
Thank you, thank you, thank you!  It must be the armed launch survey ship!  I opened it to get one page, and they were sailing from Port Sudan to "survey ground": https://s3.amazonaws.com/oldweather/ADM53-40897/0006_1.jpg

You have to use Chrome browser to read this log, the contrast is overexposed but Chrome corrects for that - the only browser that does.

Take care,
Janet
« Last Edit: February 13, 2012, 02:34:43 am by Janet Jaguar »

JamesAPrattIII

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Re: Wikipedia Updates
« Reply #22 on: May 31, 2012, 10:17:53 pm »
You might want to also update the wiki posting on the Zhemchug with the information I posted on this ship

JJhttp://forum.oldweather.org/index.php?topic=2621.msg43389#msg43389
« Last Edit: June 01, 2012, 12:34:39 am by Janet Jaguar »

Dominic McDevitt-Parks

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Re: Wikipedia Updates
« Reply #23 on: July 17, 2012, 09:32:55 pm »
Hi everyone!

I come from Wikipedia and I'm here to help. :-) I met with Kathy in person last week, and I've only just now been starting to get look around here. I'm glad you've started this thread, because it means that there will essentially be a task list.

For me, the first thing I wanted to do was see how we could use Old Weather transcriptions as citations on Wikipedia, since that is the necessary prerequisite before we can put make corrections on the basis of them. My (possibly dumb) question is how do I get at the data? Ideally, there would be a way to cite with page numbers and/or dates from logs in a Wikipedia footnote, and include links directly to the plain text transcriptions of those pages, rather than to the images. Is that possible?

Also, if someone could organize the various error reports ont his page into a neat, bulleted list that is more readable than a forum thread, that would be super useful for us to work off of.

Kathy

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Re: Wikipedia Updates
« Reply #24 on: July 17, 2012, 10:15:38 pm »
Hi Dominic -

It was a pleasure meeting you last week.  Gordon Smith, who runs Naval-History.net, is posting transcribed logs on his web site.  People are cleaning up the transcriptions.  I'm not sure how many logs have been cleaned up yet.  A posting in another thread states there are 100 ships waiting for clean-up.  Those logs can be cited and and the pages linked in Wikipedia.

I'll try to organize the list of corrections, but as I'm going on vacation Thursday, I may not be able to do it until I get back.

Yours -

Kathy

Janet Jaguar

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Re: Wikipedia Updates
« Reply #25 on: July 17, 2012, 10:18:49 pm »
Welcome, Dominic.  I'm glad this is finally going somewhere. :)  There are several different ways to do that.

I. Most Complete
Every scanned log page (all 300,000-plus of them!) for the completed 305 ships in the OW fleet can be read in its scanned original JPEG picture.  Because they are photos, they cannot be searched in that format for key words.  The JPEGs are themselves the original source of all.
And there's your massive list for that ship, each one of which has been transcribed at least 3 times.

II. Most searchable, usable
Gordon Smith, our Head Historian, has his site set up to make all these logs public.  At this time, about 100 ship's voyages have been formatted and 20 to 30 have been edited.  There you will find the above JPEG links to the log pages paired with the transcriptions, which can indeed by searched for key words.  Note should be made that since the weather data has the funding, only that is required to be transcribed.  The fully edited logs are more readable, and many have skipped notations transcribed and added.  Note that the edited history of the voyage is NOT a literal transcription, but cleaned up to be readable with correct spelling.

III. Notable for both important detail one might not search for (e.g., Dr. Sun Yat Sen on board Moorhen) and disorganization.
  • Go to the index page of the forum, and search (top right on header) for your ship name.
    Example:  HMS Torch (both of them)  produces 5 pages of passing mentions in threads
  • Go to the Main Board "The Ships, The Battles and The People" and do the same search, hoping to get only the more organized threads.
    Example:  HMS Torch (both of them)  produces 1 page of threads, including the condensed histories I made for both ships.
    http://forum.oldweather.org/index.php?topic=1206.0
    http://forum.oldweather.org/index.php?topic=885.0

Note that not listed on the Vessels page are the 10 "stow-away" ships we received - each accidentally folded in to another ship's scanned file and therefore not being tracked individually.  Torch (2) is an example of one of those stowaways, you have to go through the "View all logs" file for Torch to separate them.  Gordon did that separation on his history site, splitting the files manually.

Dominic McDevitt-Parks

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Re: Wikipedia Updates
« Reply #26 on: July 24, 2012, 04:18:05 am »
Okay, I didn't get a chance to work much on this so far, but what I wanted to do first?which is why I was asking those questions?was make a standard template so that Wikipedians can cite Old Weather material when making changes. To that end, I have created http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:Old_Weather, which is a citation template which takes the URL, vessel name, and date as parameters, and then creates citation for the ship log. You can see an example of how it would be used on the template page. Anyway, just reporting that I made a little progress!

Janet Jaguar

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Re: Wikipedia Updates
« Reply #27 on: July 26, 2012, 11:46:08 pm »
Dominic,
You will have picked up by now that all of our efforts to put information on Wiki over the last year-and-a-half-plus were because we were actively reading and transcribing Royal Navy logs, using Wiki as a primary reference source, and trying to give you the information we were discovering.  Unfortunately, your template was given to us the day after we completed the entire fleet and temporarily lost contact with those logs due to the shift from Phase 2 to Phase 3 of this project.

The good news for Wiki is, there is going to be a slow gap in obtaining lots of new logs in Phase 3 (US Coast Guard vessels in the high Arctic) and we now have been given the fleet's new address.  I'd like to advertise your invitation here and encourage our members to look up the good events they remember on their favorite ships and add them to your encyclopedia.

Please explain again to the forum how completely open Wiki has become to the hard data we have to put on your site, and maybe add a summary of how to use your offered template.  Is there also a way to start pages?  Also, there were a few events that surfaced such as finding the logs for 7 different ships all present at the Battle of Falkland Islands, WWI.  It might be interesting to know how having those documents made available to that page.

The OW Royal Navy harbour is now at http://old.oldweather.org/vessels?status=all

Janet Jaguar
« Last Edit: July 26, 2012, 11:48:59 pm by Janet Jaguar »

Janet Jaguar

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Re: Wikipedia Updates
« Reply #28 on: July 27, 2012, 04:29:54 pm »
IMPORTANT NOTE RE old.oldweather.org :

Because the RN Fleet moved to a new permanent harbor (e-address http://old.oldweather.org/vessels?status=all ), every link in Wiki that refers to the Vessel Page has been broken.  Authors and article updaters need to go into their articles and update the links.

Note that links may now exist also to the formatted and/or edited log histories at http://www.naval-history.net/OWShips-LogBooksWW1.htm .  We are still working on adding to those available.

The jpeg links to individual pages have been permanent, as assigned by the Admiralty, and are all still and always valid.

Janet Jaguar

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Re: Wikipedia Updates
« Reply #29 on: August 19, 2012, 03:22:50 pm »
I'm just wondering, because we don't want to bring in a crowd of newbies until Phase 3 is ready, but is this the time to update the article to show Phase 2 ended?

Taken care of.  ;D  JJ

Quote
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_Weather#Phase_II
Progress

All available Royal Navy logs have been been completed, as of July 23, 2012. Officially, 28,615 volunteers digitised over 1,090,000 pages on 302 ships!
[edit]Phase I

Phase I is now complete.
[edit]Phase II

Phase II, consisting of Royal Navy logs from a similar time (1912-1925) to those digitised in Phase I, is now complete.
[edit]Phase III

Phase III, consisting of logs from US ships voyaging in the Arctic and worldwide from the mid-1800s onwards, is currently being tested by OW volunteers (all welcome) and will be officially launched soon.
« Last Edit: August 19, 2012, 05:56:38 pm by Janet Jaguar »