Author Topic: Ask for expert advice  (Read 61736 times)

Janet Jaguar

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Ask for expert advice
« on: August 30, 2013, 09:36:11 am »
You can now find an 'Ask for expert advice' link under the icon representing your completed pages in My Old Weather or My Pages in the dropdown menu under your name in the upper right corner. (See picture below of what your finished pages look like on both pages.)

     

Clicking the link gives you a popup box.  Please paste the copied url of your completed transcription on this box in a reply to this topic, which is the forum link in the same popup box.  (Click here if you need help making your first post.)


Only the moderators can open these urls.  We can help you by checking your entries and offering advice if necessary. We can also seek clarification from the science team.

We cannot make changes to your transcriptions and save them. Only you, the transcriber, can save changes to your entries.




General background to our logbooks

At heart, the log is a bound book and the scanner photographing it looks down and takes a single picture of both open pages.  Then a computer cuts the picture in half so we only have to work with one at a time - that's the xxx_0.jpg and xxx_1.jpg in the picture urls.  (See Posting Links and Images (A Guide) to see how to share links or pictures of your pages with the whole forum.)  That is also why it is perfectly safe to have the date on one page and the location on the other - the two are forever joined at the hip and each data is easy to apply to both.

We do try to make a habit of always transcribing whatever is available in the heading at the top of every page regarding location and date.  Only if you are looking at a blank page for some reason with nothing to transcribe could that be skipped.  Also any noon lat/long entries.

There are a couple of things that are kind of background information, that we forget to include sometimes.  When naming a person, their rank or rating is considered to be part of their formal name, just like saying you talked to Mrs. Somebody last night.  And that is also true for ships, their nationality and type are considered part of the formal name - example: USS Enterprise.  (Aircraft carrier or spaceship, your choice. :) )  Context is what they are in the middle of or are doing. 

Both of these we try to keep TWYS, of which one formal exception is having to use periods in abbreviations.  (See Type What You See - Yes, but ...)

So, here are what we came to a consensus on being the best way to do things.  (Not necessarily the only way.)  There are several different reactions for context, depending on how much energy I had.  I most definitely would make the context TWYS, it's a habit that is all too easy to slide out of.  Please note that if I was doing that for a long list of ships, I'd type the context exactly once on a notepad doc which won't format fonts, and then copy/paste into every ship's context box as they get mentioned.  Retyping 8 times would be altogether too much for me, unless you are using Firefox and can easily use their dropdown menu after the first 2 letters typed.

A ship example here:
     category: ship
     name: Russian armored turret ship Emperor Nicolas I
     context 1: in the harbor
     context 2: Found the following men-of-war in the harbor
     context 3: Found the following men-of-war in the harbor  flying the flag of Rear Admiral

An example of persons:
     category: person
     name: Paymaster H.R. Smith, USN
     context 1: placed under arrest
     context 2: placed under arrest, for trial before a General Court Martial
     context 3: placed under arrest, for trial before a General Court Martial, of which Captain B.F. Day, USN, is President on board the US Flagship Baltimore.

I hope this helps.
« Last Edit: January 11, 2014, 09:04:30 am by Caro »

SebastianHelm

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Re: Ask for expert advice
« Reply #1 on: September 14, 2013, 05:46:17 pm »
After Joan's and Janet's encouragement, I decided to give it a try. It's not as I expected; it only gives you a link you are asked to copy and paste into the forum. So here it is:
http://oldweather.org/transcriptions/52325d52f2773361880029c8/editI picked this topic for two reasons: (1) It was my first major insecure point; I didn't know how to enter the Mentions. (By now this has already been sufficiently answered in the topic Does TWYS apply to the context field for Mentions?.) (2) The Mentions I marked are on the wrong page; they should be marked in the first insert, not the second one. 

Janet Jaguar

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Re: Ask for expert advice
« Reply #2 on: September 14, 2013, 06:03:03 pm »
First, since it is unlikely to be important that the mentions are made in the morning or afternoon to whoever is researching these ships and people, it isn't that important which order you do them in. 

Second, to reassure yourself that it won't get attached to the wrong date, make a habit of always doing the date in the top heading unless you are deciding to skip the whole page so it doesn't matter.  Making a habit of never forgetting the heading location or date isn't a bad idea in general for all pages, insert or no.

I'll go thru and check them carefully, and give you a list.  :)

Randi

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Re: Ask for expert advice
« Reply #3 on: September 14, 2013, 06:34:29 pm »
Quote
Making a habit of never forgetting the heading location or date isn't a bad idea in general for all pages, insert or no.
Definitely!
Since the date is frequently only on the Remarks page, it is best to always transcribe it so that it can be associated with the corresponding weather page.

Janet Jaguar

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Re: Ask for expert advice
« Reply #4 on: September 14, 2013, 07:03:34 pm »
First thing:  Good News, every mention you did is correct information entered in the correct tab.  I would not spend energy changing anything.  The data base will indeed have these names if someone wants to search the digital record for them.

There are a couple of things that are kind of background information, that we forget to include sometimes.  When naming a person, their rank or rating is considered to be part of their formal name, just like saying you talked to Mrs. Somebody last night.  And that is also true for ships, their nationality and type are considered part of the formal name - example: the USS Enterprise.  (Aircraft carrier or spaceship, your choice. :) )  Context is what they are in the middle of or are doing. 

Both of these we try to keep TWYS (of which one formal exception is having to use periods in abbreviations.)

So, here are what we came to a consensus on being the best way to do things.  (Not necessarily the only way.)  One of your ships mentioned, as an example.

     category: ship
     name: Russian armored turret ship Emperor Nicolas I
     context 1: Found the following men-of-war in the harbor
     context 2: Found the following men-of-war in the harbor  flying the flag of Rear Admiral

Please note that if I was doing that long a list of ships in harbor, I'd type the context exactly once on a notepad doc which won't format fonts, and then copy/paste into every ship's context box as they get mentioned.  Retyping 8 times would be altogether too much for me, unless you are using Firefox and can easily use their dropdown menu after the first 2 letters typed.

An example of persons, and here I have several different reactions for context, depending on how much energy I had.  I most definitely would make the context TWYS, it's a habit that is all too easy to slide out of.

     category: person
     name: Paymaster H.R. Smith, USN
     context 1: placed under arrest
     context 2: placed under arrest, for trial before a General Court Martial
     context 3: placed under arrest, for trial before a General Court Martial, of which Captain B.F. Day, USN, is President on board the US Flagship Baltimore.

I would never make separate mentions of either Captain Day or the US Flagship Baltimore - it just feels right that they are background information.  I don't doubt other transcribers would make some different choices.

Is this the info you are wanting?  I like the choices you made, you did every name I could see.  And I have this vision now of the Star Spangled Banner coming at them from 3 different flagships at the same time, playing it at 3 different speeds and possibly off key 3 different ways.  Ouch!

SebastianHelm

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Re: Ask for expert advice
« Reply #5 on: September 14, 2013, 07:35:50 pm »
Thanks, that's exactly what I've been hoping for!

Back to the 'Share with a moderator' link - I have a wish: I would find it most helpful if it were available from the actual Transcribe page (maybe under the DISCUSS link); that's where newbies most likely would need and see it.

Maybe we could use the http://oldweather.org/transcriptions/.../edit URLs more often, anyway. It would often be helpful for any reader of a post - not just for a moderator - to see what a transcriber marked, if only to guide the eye fast to the location in question.

Randi

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Re: Ask for expert advice
« Reply #6 on: September 14, 2013, 07:42:07 pm »
Thanks, that's exactly what I've been hoping for!

Back to the 'Share with a moderator' link - I have a wish: I would find it most helpful if it were available from the actual Transcribe page (maybe under the DISCUSS link); that's where newbies most likely would need and see it.
It would indeed be helpful. Unfortunately, the data is not accessible until the page has been saved.

Maybe we could use the http://oldweather.org/transcriptions/.../edit URLs more often, anyway. It would often be helpful for any reader of a post - not just for a moderator - to see what a transcriber marked, if only to guide the eye fast to the location in question.
That is true too, but only the moderators can see the contents of http://oldweather.org/transcriptions/.../edit URLs.

 :(

SebastianHelm

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Re: Ask for expert advice
« Reply #7 on: September 14, 2013, 07:55:12 pm »
It would indeed be helpful. Unfortunately, the data is not accessible until the page has been saved.
In that case, the link (or better a button) could just include saving the page. Since everything can be changed later, that should normally not be a problem. (With the possible exception of when a newbie accidentally deleted an entry; but I currently don't see a way to undo that anyway.)

That is true too, but only the moderators can see the contents of http://oldweather.org/transcriptions/.../edit URLs. :(
And the transcriber him/herself, or else I wouldn't be able to see mine. So, what do others see? Do they just get a "permission denied" message? If so, this is probably for a reason, so I'm not questioning the wisdom of that, but could this at least default to a redirect to the unmarked page?

Janet Jaguar

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Re: Ask for expert advice
« Reply #8 on: September 15, 2013, 02:13:51 am »
All the editing pages that allow changes have always been locked to everybody else.  It's the only way to keep people from messing up someone else's work, either by accident or because they are angry enough to want to harm the data project.  If anyone clicked someone's edit url, the computer considered them to be a newbie cadet and handed them a different page to transcribe for themselves.  Even the other transcribers for that same page will be given different editing urls.

Very recently, Stuart (our chief software creator) rigged it so only moderators (current status) or specifically requested helpers can actually see what you wrote in the gray boxes, same as what you see when you go back to do an edit.  Except our viewing page lacks a "I'm finished" button.  Even if we mods accidentally delete something or have an itch to adjust wording, we cannot save our tinkering.

Quote
Back to the 'Share with a moderator' link - I have a wish: I would find it most helpful if it were available from the actual Transcribe page (maybe under the DISCUSS link); that's where newbies most likely would need and see it.
I'm not going to tinker with a new function until we've done it often enough to know all the different kinds of people who.  It's not polite to our hard working HQ team.  But test this idea:  save the edit url before you save it and paste it on a note somewhere, and then ditto for the link the "ask the moderators" function gives you for the same page.  Be aware, there are only 3 of us spread over 7 time zones, so it's pretty certain their are periods we are all doing something else even if we left the computer on and the site open.  We all check it periodically while home and awake, but we all have lives to live too.  :)

camiller

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Re: Ask for expert advice
« Reply #9 on: September 15, 2013, 08:05:41 pm »
Hi

This is a record page from the Albatross, Jan. 1, 1884.  I have some questions about my transcription.

http://oldweather.org/transcriptions/5235e63cf2773367c6004f78/edit

In a couple of places, several crew are mentioned in one sentence.  I made an Event record for each, but only transcribed the part of the sentence pertaining to that person in the Context field.  Is this correct?

Also, in the 8am to Meridian comment,  between "Machinist" and "C. G. Herndon,"  there are some abbreviations.  I transcribed this as 'P.A. Surg. , C. G. Herndon...."  since it mentions he came from the hospital.   Is this correct?

Many thanks for your help.
Carolyn

 

Randi

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Re: Ask for expert advice
« Reply #10 on: September 15, 2013, 08:15:59 pm »
I'm looking at your transcription...

We do indeed have a Passed Assistant Surgeon C. G. Herndon: http://oldweather.s3.amazonaws.com/ow3/final/Albatross/vol009of055/vol009of055_003_0.jpg

Looks like Caro is already looking - I'll hold off for the moment ;)
« Last Edit: September 15, 2013, 08:17:39 pm by Randi »

Caro

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Re: Ask for expert advice
« Reply #11 on: September 15, 2013, 08:19:26 pm »
Indeed I was.

It all looks fine to me, Carolyn.
You have entered each name separately under Person on the Mentions tab and given the context in each case.
Including PA Surg as part of CG Herndon's name is correct too.
Thanks for submitting this page.  :)

camiller

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Re: Ask for expert advice
« Reply #12 on: September 15, 2013, 08:42:10 pm »
Great. Thanks, Caro and Randi!

camiller

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Re: Ask for expert advice
« Reply #13 on: September 16, 2013, 02:40:58 pm »
Here's another Albatross page, with "Frozen-------------" written vertically in the wet bulb column for several morning hours.  I marked/entered "frozen" as an event, and left the wet bulb column blank.  OK?

http://oldweather.org/transcriptions/523709b4f2773365da002a6f/edit

As always, thanks!
Carolyn

Janet Jaguar

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Re: Ask for expert advice
« Reply #14 on: September 16, 2013, 04:35:12 pm »
Perfect.

2 good ways to do that one, I think.  Exactly what you did, including that long line drawn is one.  Treating the vertical orientation and following line as dittos (which the long line is) is the other, putting "Frozen" in the first box and " in all following.  Depends on how much making the extra box irritates you.  :)